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--- Log opened Sat Jan 26 00:00:38 2013
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n4nd0blackburn: meeting in about 25min right?20:35
blackburnn4nd0: I think so20:38
* sonney2k starts preparations20:55
* sonney2k opens bottle of beer 20:56
@sonney2kblackburn, grab your vodka20:56
blackburnsonney2k: ready20:56
@sonney2kblackburn, cheers!20:56
* sonney2k takes a sip20:56
blackburnsonney2k: have you prepared your sausages?20:56
blackburnI am powering off my nuclear station and sipping vodka20:57
@sonney2kblackburn, sure20:57
@sonney2kI've also switched to wearing lederhosen20:57
blackburnsonney2k: well my shapka uschanka is in place20:58
n4nd0I have my wine next to me too :D20:59
-!- alexlovesdata [55b21f10@gateway/web/freenode/ip.] has joined #shogun21:00
blackburnn4nd0: hmm we need something stereotypical about you too21:00
blackburnhey there alex that loves data21:00
alexlovesdatahey blackburn21:01
alexlovesdataI am only in webchat21:01
alexlovesdatatoo stupid to get empathy running on ubuntu21:01
n4nd0blackburn: mmm I can be a bullfigther if you want21:01
blackburnn4nd0: yes bad boy I want it21:01
blackburnalexlovesdata: install pidgin! :)21:02
@sonney2kn4nd0, you sure you have two horns?21:02
n4nd0haha I hope not, otherwise I will seriously talk to my gf21:02
@sonney2kI think that is *the* acceptance criterion for a bull21:02
-!- cwidmer [4a49bc61@gateway/web/freenode/ip.] has joined #shogun21:02
blackburnn4nd0: do you feel horny?21:02
cwidmerhi guys21:03
blackburnand the mighty christian klaus!21:03
@sonney2kn4nd0, more like bullying maybe *SCNR*21:03
@sonney2khi cwidmer!21:03
@sonney2kwhere is heiko?21:03
cwidmer"do you feel horny?" what's going on here, your minds in the gutter again ;)?21:03
n4nd0sonney2k: :D21:03
blackburnit happens, cwidmer :(21:04
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@sonney2kcwidmer, n4nd0 suggested a new nick bullfighter21:04
@sonney2kcwidmer, so I started a discussion about #horns21:05
cwidmerhaha, alright21:05
-!- alexlovesdata1 [] has joined #shogun21:05
@sonney2kor better one missing... thats how it goes here21:05
blackburnsonney2k: you don't have to be sorry21:05
@sonney2klet me email heiko21:05
blackburnand explain my bad behavior21:05
@sonney2khei"the brain"ko21:05
@sonney2kblackburn, n4nd0, alexlovesdata1, cwidmer - could you use your addresses when posting on the mailinglist?21:06
n4nd0sure, I forgot that I have one21:06
blackburnsure but forgive me if I forget to set right mail21:06
cwidmerphew, I'll take a look21:06
cwidmertoo many email addresses already21:07
cwidmermpg, tu-berlin, two at msk21:07
cwidmerbut should be ok21:07
cwidmerat least this one will stick around for a while21:07
blackburnFOR EVER21:07
cwidmernot like mpg which deletes our account not long after you leave21:07
@sonney2kit helps people to realize who is wildly guessing :)21:08
@sonney2kcwidmer, as long as the domain exists it will be there21:08
cwidmerfair enough21:08
alexlovesdata1will do21:09
@sonney2kanyway heiko has vanished... no idea where he is21:09
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, do you still have technical problems doing so?21:09
alexlovesdata1for sending email as have'nt tried yet21:10
alexlovesdata1will try now21:10
alexlovesdata1via my tu-berlin account21:10
blackburnmultiple emails is a pure evil21:10
@sonney2kso about the workshop - I assume everybody here will come right?21:10
@sonney2kblackburn, I have ~100 addresses...21:10
@sonney2klower bound :D21:11
cwidmerI'll come if I'm in Germany, but that's the current plan21:11
cwidmerwill know for sure in a few months21:11
alexlovesdata1for me the same as for cwidmer21:11
@sonney2kcwidmer, I guess gunnar will be there too - others of mkcc?21:11
alexlovesdata1intend to come21:11
blackburnI'll come if I am not killed by a bus21:11
cwidmermaybe marius will come, not sure if he's attending ismb21:12
@sonney2kwe need to somehow get some headcount21:12
cwidmermight be a good idea for him to get into bio21:12
n4nd0I will come!21:12
@sonney2kcwidmer, poor marius21:12
cwidmerit'll take time21:12
cwidmerfun to have him around, though21:12
cwidmeranyway, I could imagine that philipp and andre might want to come21:13
cwidmerbut only if they are at ISMB anyway21:13
cwidmerdon't think any of the new students will make it this year, but who knows21:13
@sonney2kcwidmer, ok21:13
alexlovesdata1@sonney2k: email via as a second identity or does it have a mailserver on it?21:13
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, second identity only21:14
@sonney2kso to get an estimate of the headcount - what do we do?21:14
@sonney2kI mean not that we are just 10 people but ask for c-base mainhall which could easily fit 8021:14
cwidmerso everyone except alex and I here will come for sure?21:14
@sonney2kmy thoughts on this a) set up some submission form on shogun-toolbox.org21:15
cwidmerI mean, we haven't started seriously advertising yet, the number could go up, depending on the "progam"21:15
@sonney2kb) simple write email to register - which would need somebody (not me) to take care of the people21:16
blackburngoogle docs forms should help here21:16
alexlovesdata1what means to take care = have a spreadsheet of participants?21:16
blackburnI can manage this list21:16
cwidmerblackburn, that should do21:16
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, that and send a - thanks email and answer all the questions to come21:17
cwidmerjust a simple sheet with a form front-end21:17
alexlovesdata1answer silly questions about berlin i can do21:17
blackburnI will have a lot of silly questions about berlin21:18
cwidmerjust send everyone to berghain21:18
alexlovesdata1your telephone lady Alex is patient :)21:18
@sonney2kso alexlovesdata1, blackburn - we generate some mailinglist sth like workshop@shogun-toolbox.org21:18
@sonney2kregister everyone here and you take care of saying thanks?21:18
@sonney2kand answer questions right?21:18
blackburnhmm wait21:19
@sonney2kissue of course is that this mailinglist will be public and we will get spam21:19
blackburnI think thanks should be in personal21:19
alexlovesdata1cant be worse than the gsoc mentors list21:19
alexlovesdata1maybe we should make clear that we cannot provide invitation letters to visa21:19
blackburnhaha yes21:20
blackburnI'd need one21:20
alexlovesdata1this happens for some low-fee conferences21:20
alexlovesdata1you are exceptional :D21:20
@sonney2kblackburn, what I mean is - they write an email to workshop@ ... and you reply CC'ing workshop@21:20
blackburnso I'll go as a tourist :)21:20
blackburnsonney2k: ah okay right21:20
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, why can we not provide invitation letters for visa?21:21
blackburnsonney2k: can you provide such letters?21:21
@sonney2kI've done this for one of the workshop's I was organizing21:21
@sonney2kit is just some email21:21
blackburnit is really relevant for me :D21:21
alexlovesdata1for blackburn it is ok21:21
blackburnas I am located in the third world country21:22
@sonney2kblackburn, there is some draft for e.g. google mentor summit on the gsoc site21:22
alexlovesdata1but you will get people from non-eu countries ask for an invitation letter ... I am not sure who is responsible if they do not take the flight back (!)21:22
blackburnhaha that's funny21:22
alexlovesdata1no, just a second-world democracy :D21:22
blackburnalexlovesdata1: oh democracy, I have seen that word somewhere before :D21:23
@sonney2kblackburn, we don't even have that word in germany :P21:23
blackburnsonney2k: good old song of sonney2k21:23
@sonney2kblackburn, so fine with that?21:23
blackburnblackburn: with what?21:23
cwidmersonney2k, so have you guys decided on the format yet? I guess there will be some tutorials etc? hackathons? unconference?21:24
blackburnworkshop@ ?21:24
blackburnyes I like that21:24
@sonney2kcwidmer, please take over the lead brb21:24
alexlovesdata1the point is sonne, I have invited people personally already, and I know that I would be personally liable with abschiebekosten if they do not return ...21:24
blackburncwidmer: that's next on the list I guess21:24
blackburnalexlovesdata1: abschiebekosten?21:24
cwidmerwell first of all, it'll be a two day thing, correct?21:24
blackburnthat sounds like you was set on fire21:25
blackburnor killed with an axe21:25
cwidmerwe could set up a list of proposals for tutorials21:25
cwidmerI'm willing to talk about some of my stuff, either Multitask stuff or sequence analysis21:25
cwidmershare some code21:25
cwidmerwe could also collect proposals for hackathons21:25
cwidmerwho else would be willing to give a talk, blackburn?21:26
blackburncwidmer: I am willing to talk for sure21:26
blackburnif you get my russian accent21:26
cwidmersure, it'll just be more convincing that you know what you're talking about21:26
n4nd0I would like to talk too! I could maybe present the SO framework21:27
cwidmerthat'd be awesome!21:27
blackburnwell I can talk about dimensionality reduction, SURPRISED? :D21:27
alexlovesdata1do we have a talk about code structures in general?21:27
cwidmerit has it's place btw21:27
@sonney2kcwidmer, one day!21:28
cwidmersee? ;)21:28
alexlovesdata1something like: adding some functionality tutorial / or something on the implicite code styles imposed by sonne on us ;)21:28
cwidmerunder 'just looking' and 'pca doesn't work' ;)21:28
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heiko2Hi all21:29
blackburnso here heiko2 comes21:29
cwidmerhi heiko21:29
heiko2Very sorry for the delay, I was stuck in the London tube without any signal21:29
cwidmersonney2k, so it's two days?21:29
n4nd0hello heiko221:29
heiko2*reading channel logs*21:29
blackburncwidmer: I am afraid one21:30
cwidmerthat's dense21:30
alexlovesdata1suggestion: if there are much more talks and weather is promising we can have a talk sit-in in a park21:30
cwidmershould we make an optional second one for hackathons and internal discussion?21:30
@sonney2kcwidmer, *ONE* day21:30
alexlovesdata1we just need a sufficiently strong beamer for that21:30
cwidmergood idea21:31
cwidmertempelhof ;)21:31
alexlovesdata1that would be an unofifcial 2nd day ;)21:31
alexlovesdata1could be21:31
blackburnin sonney2k's flat21:31
@sonney2kblackburn, you could camp in the garden :)21:31
cwidmeris there a room at TU we could use for this?21:31
cwidmerin the fancy new building?21:32
@sonney2k^ alexlovesdata121:32
cwidmeror even the old one ;)21:32
blackburnwe can party in the old broken TU21:32
alexlovesdata1for the 2nd day?21:32
cwidmer2nd day21:32
heiko2sonney2k, the logs only go until 2015, did anything else happen in these 15 minutes? :)21:32
alexlovesdata1I could try to find out21:32
@sonney2kthat would be saturday though21:32
alexlovesdata1will find out about this21:32
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, please do21:32
cwidmerok, great21:32
cwidmernow for the main event - what do you have in mind?21:33
cwidmermainly tutorials?21:33
cwidmerwake up :P21:33
@sonney2kcwidmer, I am totally open21:33
n4nd0cwidmer: what other ideas could be?21:34
@sonney2kn4nd0, heiko2, wiking_, your opinons21:34
cwidmerpanel discussion21:34
alexlovesdata1in the evening something party like for networking ??21:34
cwidmerbig data blah, the next big thing in ML, the future of shogun21:34
cwidmerthat's critical21:35
heiko2I would say tutorials should be in there21:35
@sonney2k(workshop's I've organized where usually like talk talks poster / (panel) discussion - lots of breaks)21:35
cwidmerwe have to have a nice evening event21:35
@sonney2kmaybe we can do some grill event in the evening21:35
@sonney2kwhen the weather is nice21:35
alexlovesdata1tutorials + a break for a poster session?21:35
cwidmerwill they kick us out at some time or do we have cbase all night?21:35
blackburncwidmer: I'd like to present my vision of future of shogun with some discussion21:35
heiko2barbecue is a very nice idea :)21:35
@sonney2kcwidmer, we have c-base (not exclusively) from 11-19hrs21:36
@sonney2kit is berlin summer, c-base is at river spree21:36
@sonney2kso we could do something outside21:36
cwidmersounds great21:36
@sonney2kbut there will of course be others lurking around :)21:36
cwidmerwe should have a plan B though21:36
blackburnget drunk21:36
blackburnthat's B21:36
cwidmerno, that's part of plans A-Z21:36
cwidmerquestions is where21:37
alexlovesdata1so we need tutorials+ poster session with break + panel discussion + a park grill in the evning?21:37
@sonney2kcwidmer, exactly21:37
heiko2poster sessions?21:37
heiko2which posters?`_=21:37
cwidmernot sure about posters21:37
@sonney2kone more question - how serious do we want this event to be?21:37
@sonney2kheiko2, about certain algorithms we have in shogun21:37
@sonney2kgory details21:37
@sonney2kwe don't have to...21:38
alexlovesdata1people may want to talk about their scientific work with the posters??21:38
cwidmerhow about a session where people pitch questions to the shogun/guest audience and get some feedback how they could approach their problem... this only works if there are "practitioners" in the audience21:38
alexlovesdata1as a posotive side effect?21:38
n4nd0cwidmer: I think that is a good idea21:38
heiko2sonney2k, I think the question is how many people from "outside" will come, so if most people are well known, it doesnt have to be superserious, if others are joining a more serious setting could be usefull21:38
n4nd0something more oriented to the people coming to visit to affect shogun with their suggestions and ideas21:39
cwidmerI guess this depends on the kind of people that sign up for this, if it's ML scientists like most of us or people using shogun as a technology21:39
heiko2maybe a good mix is a good idea21:39
heiko2so there could be some technical tutorials21:39
cwidmeryes, we should definitely keep a list of ideas and have people do some voting before21:39
heiko2how to install /external dependencies etc21:40
heiko2maybe we should come up with a list here and put this online for voting21:40
heiko2good idea21:40
cwidmerI really like the SO tutorial idea, also blackburn could give a nice tutorial on either dim-reduct or L1-MTL21:40
heiko2An introduction on how to hack shogun would also be cool to cast new developers21:41
heiko2And I think some examples on how to use shogun for std tasks would be cool21:41
blackburnyeah sure21:42
cwidmerthis would be a basic shogun tutorial21:42
cwidmersomething for our beloved dictator, maybe?21:42
heiko2I know many people that are afraid of using shogun because it is complicated21:42
cwidmerI set up this doc to collect ideas21:42
alexlovesdata1can we do a talk about successful applications of shogun? do we have some material about works where shogun was used for excellent something?21:43
heiko2Classifier evaluation tutorial would also be cool (x-validation, gradient descent on error functions ...)21:43
blackburnheiko2: that sounds like something for you21:44
heiko2blackburn, yes maybe21:44
@sonney2kcwidmer, I hereby declare you to be the program committee21:45
heiko2hacking shogun (create new classes, what tools exist, how to create new interfaces... )21:45
blackburnsonney2k: do you want to talk about how do you see future of shogun?21:45
heiko2anybody knows how many non-German people will come?21:46
@sonney2kblackburn, maybe in a panel discussion with other topics?21:46
@sonney2kheiko2, no21:46
@sonney2kheiko2, we don't know who / how many will come21:46
blackburnwe should avoid german or I don't get a word :D21:46
@sonney2kheiko2, we first need some kind of program / plan21:46
heiko2so I guess english will be the language :)21:46
n4nd0yeah same here about German hehe21:46
alexlovesdata1is the date close to some mach learn/computvis/datamining/bioscience conferemce?21:47
heiko2I always love it when a group of German people is talking english to each other with these massicve German accent :)21:47
@sonney2kGerman is stupid anyways21:47
@sonney2kanyway, do we want external submissions21:47
@sonney2kas in talks / posters / whatever from others?21:47
cwidmeralexlovesdata1, there is ISMB21:47
heiko2it would be ultra cool to have some people that use shogun for science and talk about it21:48
blackburnis there any?21:48
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@sonney2klike call for talks / contributions / or even some special issue in some journal...21:48
alexlovesdata1talks+poster should be peer-reviewed21:49
alexlovesdata1at least the talks21:49
cwidmerheiko2, shogun is very commonly used for bioological sequence analysis21:49
alexlovesdata1in the sense that we can check whether it makes sense ... ever reviewed non-sense submissions to ml conferences?21:50
heiko2cwidmer, yeah, so this would be cool to have explained by somebody21:50
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, some voting among us should be sufficient21:50
alexlovesdata1@sonne agree21:50
heiko2on what should we have this public vote?21:51
@sonney2kcwidmer, heiko2 - we should actually found some shogun e.V. at this event!21:51
heiko2maybe on the algorithms inside shogun introduced?21:51
heiko2sonney2k, great idea!21:51
blackburnwhat is e.V.?21:52
@sonney2kblackburn, shogun foundation21:52
blackburnwhat is it for?21:52
alexlovesdata1e.V. = eingetragener Verein21:52
heiko2we are enough people21:52
@sonney2kblackburn, to act as entity21:52
blackburnalexlovesdata1: oh you helped me a lot :D21:52
alexlovesdata1non-profit foundation by german law21:52
blackburneingetragener Verein is much more digestable for me :D21:52
heiko2blackburn, to gain tax saving for example21:52
@sonney2ke.g. shogun foundation could get money / pay tax etc21:53
alexlovesdata1i helped you to google for it, blackburn ;)21:53
blackburnI see21:53
blackburnalexlovesdata1: jk21:53
@sonney2kso how does the program look like21:53
@sonney2kcwidmer, ^21:53
heiko2cwidmer, if many biology people coming, I could introduce the statistical hypothesis testing framework, thats something for high-throughput data21:53
cwidmersounds good21:54
cwidmerso when do we start?21:54
cwidmerwhat time21:54
cwidmerhmm, how about lunch21:55
cwidmerorder pizza?21:55
cwidmerin the evening, right?21:55
n4nd0BBQ is more evening oriented21:55
heiko2well ok21:55
cwidmerwe need food for lunch to fuel us for all that ML21:55
n4nd0pizza would be fine I think21:56
heiko2Is the c-base in an area where there is a lot of street food?21:56
cwidmershouldn't be the first time people order pizza to cbase21:56
alexlovesdata1pizza = how stereotypical ;)21:56
heiko2cwidmer haha :)21:56
@sonney2kheiko2, not a lot but it is close to alexanderplatz21:56
@sonney2klike one train station away21:56
@sonney2kso should not be an issue21:56
cwidmerI think it's better to have food there21:57
cwidmerotherwise it'll take too much time21:57
heiko2sonney2k, so not mnuch travelling for good lunch, then we could just organise a pizza order and everyone who is not into stereotypes just eats out21:57
@sonney2kordering pizza would work sure21:57
cwidmermaybe we could have a 30min window to start eating and then merge this into the panel discussion21:57
n4nd0good idea21:58
@sonney2k1 hour break21:58
@sonney2kand no session above 1:30 w/o break21:58
blackburnin other way we get dead men21:58
heiko2or even only 1h21:58
heiko2since there is so much stuff21:59
blackburnthat's going to be quite dense21:59
cwidmerso at cbase, it's safe to assume that there will be space for everyone to set up their laptop, right?21:59
heiko2oh, what about our tutorial project?21:59
blackburnheiko2: 2nd day?21:59
heiko2We should do something with that!21:59
alexlovesdata1the question is rather: what happens to the w-lan if 100 people go online with laptop + smartphone21:59
blackburnor third?21:59
alexlovesdata1some conferences crumble under that load21:59
@sonney2kcwidmer, wireless powerplugs are a non-issue21:59
cwidmerso who ever wanted to could to some ipython notebook style tutorial to code along21:59
cwidmersonne2k more concerned about tables22:00
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, 100 people is certainly an upper limit :)22:00
@sonney2kcwidmer, also a non issue22:00
@sonney2knot exactly that comfortable but will work22:01
cwidmergood, that answers my question :)22:01
cwidmerok, so what is a good time slot for tutorials?22:02
cwidmermin 30min, I'd say22:02
cwidmermax 1hr22:02
cwidmermaybe something like 45min including discussion?22:02
@sonney2kcwidmer, tutorials are usually first / early22:02
cwidmerso we do two tutorials and then coffee break22:02
@sonney2kcwidmer, or one in the morning one after lunch22:03
@sonney2kcwidmer, since I assume we have no keynotes right?22:03
@sonney2kcwidmer, or does gunnar want to talk about sth like ML in general?22:03
cwidmershould we try to invite speakers?22:03
cwidmerI think he wouldn't mind22:03
@sonney2kcwidmer, we could have *one* very broad ML talk22:04
cwidmerfeel like doing that?22:04
@sonney2kto show off what one can do22:04
cwidmerwe could ask Gunnar for sure22:04
alexlovesdata1better talks about future and specific applications fields ?22:04
@sonney2kcwidmer, gunnar did this lots of times and he is good in doing this22:04
heiko2sonney2k cwidmer, he also might attract more people to come since well-known22:05
@sonney2kcwidmer, alright so some tutorial I (someone willing to co-do this cwidmer you?) should give and gunnar some ML overview22:05
@sonney2kcwidmer, I think we should have some call for contributions22:06
@sonney2kI mean some scientists might not be allowed to go w/o presenting22:06
cwidmersure, I'm willing to help out22:07
cwidmergood point22:07
heiko2sonney2k, this would be cool, I could even advertise this here at UCL - they have big travel funds22:07
cwidmerhowever, keep in mind that there is a chance I'll be stuck in the US for some reason22:07
alexlovesdata1so there we are back for the question about invited talks and a poster session?22:08
cwidmerI think this is a strong argument for posters22:08
alexlovesdata1I mean invited talks could be held by people who are somewhat higher ranked22:08
cwidmerwhy don't we just combine the poster session with the (beginning of) the social event22:08
alexlovesdata1and can talk even about general ML without saying blabla like gunnar22:08
n4nd0I can say it also around here at KTH, I know at least a postdoc who has used shogun for his research in robotics22:08
alexlovesdata1and posters for the others?22:09
alexlovesdata1the poster session can be also at  the end of the lunch break22:09
alexlovesdata1to avoid losses from food seekers getting lost in Berlin22:09
alexlovesdata1alternative: in a longer afternoon break (30-45 minutes?)22:10
cwidmerboth possible22:11
cwidmerI would probably vote for combining lunch with panel discussion and posters with drinking22:11
cwidmerkeeps discussions vivid22:11
alexlovesdata1also a good idea ;)22:11
blackburnI can post something about this event at biggest russian ML website22:11
blackburndoes that make sense?22:11
n4nd0lunch with panel discussion sounds like a good idea22:11
@sonney2konce we have some program ready we should send out a call for contributions / announcement to all relevant places22:12
@sonney2kn4nd0, hmmh I don't know. can you talk while eating?22:13
@sonney2kpanelists will starve...22:13
heiko2good point, maybe only half overlapping22:13
cwidmerah, btw22:14
cwidmerwe could try to have companies sponsor lunch, drinks and dinner22:14
cwidmernot sure if ccc will kick us out then22:14
blackburncompanies like?22:15
blackburnmicrosoft? :D22:15
alexlovesdata1the german secret service (BND) :D22:15
cwidmergoogle, ms, amazon22:15
cwidmeramazon would be good22:15
cwidmerconsidering they are starting big in berlin22:15
blackburnyeah it could become something special22:15
n4nd0sonney2k: like the idea that cwidmer said before, half an hour for lunch and later we start the panel, people can continue eating pizza then if they want so22:15
heiko2cwidmer I like the idea of having these companies involved22:16
heiko2shogun gets more attention by them this way22:17
cwidmerhow about tomtom?22:17
blackburngoogle knows us22:17
blackburnhah tomtom22:17
cwidmerI'm pretty sure we get google funding for some pizza or something, maybe even a best poster price22:18
alexlovesdata1best poster price sounds good!22:18
heiko2not sap!22:18
heiko2they did a workshop at UCL a while ago and this stuff sucks so much22:18
heiko2oh wait, this was SAS :)22:19
alexlovesdata1I mean the idea of getting companies in it is that they might carry away some developers?22:19
blackburnhah sas sap what's the difference, right heiko2?22:19
alexlovesdata1four girls carry away blackburn ;)22:19
heiko2blackburn, hehe :)22:19
heiko2blackburn, I meant the data guys22:20
blackburnI am afraid I will be with my gf :D22:20
alexlovesdata1if you drink she might quadruplicate ;)22:20
heiko2had one of them present sas at UCL, and the guy had no idea about anything, and the code editor was in comic-sans22:20
blackburnoh that's the good shot alexlovesdata122:20
blackburnheiko2: haha lol22:20
blackburnheiko2: no idea about anything? what did he present?22:21
heiko2blackburn, didnt you once tell me you explained SVM to your girl? :)22:21
blackburnheiko2: she knows svms22:21
heiko2blackburn, klicking buttons22:21
blackburnheiko2: her thesis was about multiclass svms :D22:21
heiko2blackburn, well then she is welcome :)22:21
heiko2blackburn, wow :)22:21
blackburnsome comparison but she knows something about that22:22
heiko2you should have her programing for shogun22:22
heiko2she could join with sonney2k's kids :)22:22
blackburnI could encourage her becoming gsoc student but this could be unfair22:22
blackburnsounds like corrupcy :D22:22
blackburnthe second word is better I guess22:23
blackburnor 'the thing that happen in russia everywhere' may be?22:23
alexlovesdata1maybe we should catch all the ideas off this chat logs on Monday?22:24
alexlovesdata1my gf went to bed sleeping is a seemingly pissing mood :|22:24
blackburnthat could mean you should go too :D22:24
alexlovesdata1yes ... :(22:25
alexlovesdata1nerd: programming instead of copul...22:25
cwidmerok, there is a prelimiary schedule in the google doc22:25
cwidmerI think it's a bit too passive at the momemt22:25
blackburnbut it compresses some ideas22:26
cwidmerI'm thinking we should add some unconference-style session in between22:26
cwidmerquestion is how we decide on this22:26
blackburndance benchmark22:26
cwidmerthe voting should take place before the meeting22:26
blackburnbenchmark sounds like ML22:26
cwidmerotherwise it'll take up too much time22:26
alexlovesdata1hack in for detecting sad vs happy faces from participants taken via cam?22:27
cwidmersonney2k, are there small rooms available like at GSoC mentor summit?22:27
blackburnalexlovesdata1: and this sounds like opencv22:27
heiko2cwidmer, we could have a challenge for the participants22:28
heiko2like: here is a dataset, use shogun to get good results22:28
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heiko2have a price paid by tomtom22:28
cwidmeryeah, good idea22:28
blackburnhaha tomtom doesn't know they have to pay for that yet !22:28
cwidmerand we could release this upfront22:29
cwidmerand have the winner give a talk22:29
heiko2sonney2k, will tell them :)22:29
heiko2cwidmer, thats also cool22:29
cwidmersomeone will need to organize something interesting22:29
@sonney2kcwidmer, well c-base is a starship22:29
cwidmerthat takes time22:29
alexlovesdata1a poster price is more attractive for the majority I guess22:29
heiko2But also thought of how to get things a bit more interactive22:29
@sonney2kone seminar room / one main hall22:29
heiko2maybe we could have just an hour where everyone can ask developers questions or something like this22:29
@sonney2kbut we get the main hall only if we have lots of participants22:30
@sonney2ksay ~5022:30
cwidmerah only two rooms22:31
cwidmerwell, if the weather is nice, two sessions could go outside22:31
@sonney2kcwidmer, actually I would love to hear about any applications of shogun to real world problems...22:32
@sonney2kcwidmer, do you plan for 500+ people/22:32
cwidmeryeah, that could go into the applications slot22:32
cwidmergsoc mentor summit style, but only a small session22:32
cwidmerfor example22:32
@sonney2kcwidmer, handshaking event?22:32
cwidmerjust to get people to talk more and listen less22:32
heiko2cwidmer, what do you mean gsoc mentor summit style?22:33
cwidmerwell, why not, but you need to organize22:33
cwidmerI would feel silly22:33
alexlovesdata1for that we have poster session + evening event??22:33
cwidmerunconference style:
heiko2sonney2k, cwidmer, what about an academic speed-dating, like everyone shakes hand of everyone and introduces oneself in 2 mins?22:33
heiko2this way, everybody would at least talk once to everybody22:34
@sonney2kcwidmer, looking at the schedule22:34
@sonney2kI somehow think the panel discussion should be at the end22:34
cwidmermaybe we could start the unconference proposals upfront (via mailing list) and continue in coffee breaks22:34
n4nd0it sounds funny this academic speed-dating :D but it could turn out to be nice22:35
heiko2n4nd0, I did this quite a few times and it always was nice22:35
@sonney2kheiko2, I like this a lot?22:35
@sonney2kheiko2, when is this usually done?22:35
heiko2alway got some emails afterwards:  "hey you were the guy doing XYZ which I found interested"22:35
heiko2sonney2k, in the beginning after introduction22:35
heiko2even got one little project out of this22:36
heiko2clustering bird sounds from a biologist with MMD :)22:36
blackburndoesn't that require 2*(N(N-1)/2) minutes?22:36
cwidmerhaha lol22:36
cwidmershake hands would be the 10sec variant of that22:37
heiko2blackburn, the way its usually done is via two circles of people, and the outer one rotates22:37
cwidmerwhich we did at gsoc, which turned out to be fun22:37
heiko2no introducing oneself is the point22:37
heiko2and one can stop after 30 mins, since its exhausting22:37
heiko2but you meet 75% of the people22:37
@sonney2kcwidmer, can you put the schedule as a post under once we are done and send out an email to the mailinglist to open it for discussion?22:37
heiko2sonney2k, cwidmer, blackburn, I think we should in general get people talking to each other, this lots of positive effects. And usually ML nerds dont talk to much to each other :)22:38
@sonney2kheiko2, full ack22:39
cwidmersonney2k, sure, have to check how to post there though22:39
@sonney2kI like the speeddating thing22:39
heiko2we could also make some groups of people use shogun on the spot to solve some easy problem22:39
blackburnI think I will talk a lot after two vodkas22:39
@sonney2klets do it at the beginning!22:39
cwidmerheiko2 yes, true22:39
heiko2so that people actually work together22:39
heiko2at least a bit22:39
@sonney2kand then I would want gunnar to give a general ML intro22:39
heiko2blackburn, but some people might be scared by a drunk Russian :D22:40
@sonney2kand then some user contributed talks22:40
cwidmerthat's why we need sponsored cocktails as social catalyser22:40
@sonney2kand then break and then maybe shogun tutorial22:40
@sonney2kand then user contributed / turial but panel discussions at the *end*22:40
cwidmerfeel free to shuffle sessions around, its at the bottom of the document22:41
cwidmerhowever, I think tutorials should be longer than 15min22:41
cwidmeryou can say close to nothing in 15min22:41
@sonney2kcwidmer, sure22:41
@sonney2kno < 15 minutes stuff22:41
alexlovesdata1tutorials should be 30-45 minutes22:41
heiko2maybe even the 15 should be 2022:42
@sonney2kif we have posters spotlight session22:42
alexlovesdata1maybe application stories in 15-30 minutes?22:42
cwidmerI would like to alternate between interactive and passive22:42
cwidmeralex, sounds reasonable22:42
@sonney2kguys, our mailinglist has 234 subscribers (nice number btw :)22:42
@sonney2kso lets say we have 10 times more users22:43
@sonney2k1-2% come + some outsiders22:43
blackburnwow that's math22:43
@sonney2kso ~50 participants?22:43
blackburnhaha we knew the answer22:43
heiko2sonney2k, I think that is a bit too optimistic22:44
cwidmerI think so, too22:44
cwidmerdepends on our advertising, though22:44
@sonney2kheiko2, cwidmer what is your guess?22:44
cwidmerI would guess, core devs plus 3022:44
@sonney2kheiko2, for example a couple of people from berlin uni's will come22:44
cwidmerbut if all of us post to our university mailing lists etc22:44
heiko2sonney2k, that would be cool22:44
@sonney2kcwidmer, core devs + 30?22:44
cwidmerwe can push this up22:45
@sonney2kso ~4022:45
cwidmerno idea, really22:45
cwidmerhard to tell22:45
blackburnwho added GPs?22:45
heiko2me :)22:45
blackburnthere is no one to talk about GPs22:45
cwidmermaybe even part of the CCC crowd will come22:45
@sonney2kcwidmer, I know of one22:45
heiko2I could do this if somebody is ound22:45
heiko2currently using them for work22:45
heiko2and there are more22:45
heiko2GPs is something that would be very cool to extend in order to get more statisticians on boards22:46
heiko2especially once the R-bindings are working22:46
cwidmerI think oli stegle will be at ISMB22:46
@sonney2kcwidmer, you said you wanted alternating passive/active?22:46
cwidmerwe can ask if he's willing to contribute tutorial22:46
blackburnheiko2: I think I should ask you a few questions about GPs later22:47
@sonney2kbut what active do we have except panel discussion?22:47
cwidmerto postpone the passing out of people22:47
cwidmerwell, the unconference session22:47
cwidmercould be one22:47
heiko2blackburn, sure, if you are not asking for "how to make them fast"22:47
cwidmerand poster session22:47
blackburnheiko2: hah but predictions are fast, aren't they?22:47
@sonney2kpanel discussion / poster session are sth people like to skip22:48
cwidmernot if there is food22:48
cwidmerlet me correct22:48
heiko2blackburn, depends22:48
cwidmerfree food22:48
@sonney2kor... there is sth going on22:48
blackburngood point about food :D22:48
blackburnmay be we even get some homeless22:48
heiko2if you do Bayesian hyperparameters than not, but lets postpone this22:48
blackburnbecause of that22:48
@sonney2klike some big shot giving a talk directly before22:48
cwidmerare there foosball tables?22:48
cwidmerthe blackburn lookalike contenst should do22:49
@sonney2kcwidmer, yeah sure22:50
blackburnwho is that fan of me who added this?22:50
@sonney2kI guess this is an easy win22:50
@sonney2kjust bring your bear and vodka22:50
heiko2blackburn, I am the fan :)22:50
cwidmerok, what's the verdict?22:50
cwidmersonney2k, feel free to shuffle around the program22:51
cwidmeras far as I'm concerned it's a good start22:51
@sonney2kcwidmer, shuffling22:51
cwidmernote that the actual times are all the way down22:52
alexlovesdata1blackburn: don't homeless taste like old meat??22:52
cwidmersaw the new page22:52
blackburnalexlovesdata1: I am scared22:52
blackburnhave you ever taste homeless?22:52
blackburnI got it22:52
cwidmeras if a ml meeting wasn't nerdy enough already22:58
alexlovesdata1anythinh organizational to be discussed yet?22:59
blackburnyeah - do we have anything still?22:59
blackburnalexlovesdata1's girl is waiting22:59
n4nd0hehe nothing that I can think of23:00
n4nd0we should probably organize some of the ideas mentioned23:00
@sonney2kcwidmer, what is that unconference thing?23:01
cwidmerwell, gsoc style smaller meetings23:01
@sonney2kyou want to have spontaneous discussions?23:01
cwidmere.g. R-users shogun23:01
cwidmeror bio users23:01
@sonney2kcwidmer, but in smaller groups?23:02
cwidmeror industry applications23:02
cwidmeror whatever23:02
@sonney2kso people should grab a coffee an meet in one corner etc?23:02
@sonney2kalright makes sense - shouldn't be unconference style but we need some vote for subjects23:03
@sonney2k30 mins right?23:03
cwidmerwe could people have propose meetings upfront23:03
cwidmerand we put up whiteboards with topics on it23:03
cwidmerand people are asked to vote23:03
cwidmerand top scoring topics will be held23:03
cwidmerquite liked it at gsoc23:04
cwidmerand its easier for us as we are fewer23:04
blackburnI like that more than dating23:04
cwidmercould be 2x30 min23:04
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cwidmerblackburn, same here23:06
blackburnmost of people can get shy23:06
blackburnor so23:06
blackburnand it takes a lot of time23:06
cwidmerI mean anyone can shake hands, but it takes time23:07
cwidmerok guys, is there anything left to discuss?23:08
@sonney2kI think the speed dating is *very* helpful23:08
@sonney2kfrom gsoc23:08
@sonney2kcwidmer, yeah we need some plan how to proceed23:09
@sonney2kwhen to meet next for this23:09
@sonney2kand who does what by then23:09
blackburnlet me prepare the form23:10
cwidmerso have we finalized the program?23:10
@sonney2kcwidmer, not at all :/23:10
cwidmerhow shall we proceed?23:11
@sonney2kwe cannot have poster session overlapping with bbq23:11
@sonney2kor we have to start bbq at 18 hrs already23:11
@sonney2kI reserved from 11-19hrs23:11
@sonney2kso there might be sth else going on inside of c-base23:12
cwidmerany way to reserve longer?23:12
@sonney2kone important date23:12
@sonney2kI will present our 'program' to the c-base circle meeting on feb 1st23:12
@sonney2kcwidmer, maybe23:12
@sonney2kbut we need to have it 'ready' for that23:12
cwidmerok, how about we clarify our actual time constraints and then fix the final program23:13
cwidmerand we meet again in exactly a week from now23:13
cwidmerfeb 2nd?23:14
@sonney2kcwidmer, I think we should have poster sessions in all breaks23:14
@sonney2kaka everyone can put up posters in the beginning23:14
@sonney2kand then when there are breaks23:14
@sonney2kpeople can discuss and go to posters23:14
cwidmersure, maybe people can leave their posters up23:14
@sonney2kso we do a bit more breaks23:14
cwidmersure, sounds good23:14
cwidmerbut it's also nice to kick off the sociel event at night23:15
cwidmergets people talking23:15
cwidmerI think everyone else has passed out23:15
cwidmerblackburn, wake up!23:15
blackburncwidmer: hah23:15
blackburnI am not asleep23:16
cwidmerwhere am I23:16
cwidmersonney2k, should we then meet again on feb2nd for finalizing the structure?23:16
blackburnI am a little lost already23:17
blackburnshould think about my ideas23:17
blackburnif I ever had any23:17
cwidmerI like the lookalike contenst23:17
@sonney2kcwidmer, blackburn look at the new program23:18
cwidmershould be fun23:18
@sonney2kI think it is quite OK now23:18
blackburnsonney2k: last page?23:18
@sonney2ksaying new program or sth23:18
blackburnlooks ok for me23:18
blackburnbut quite dense23:19
cwidmerworks for me23:19
@sonney2knot too dense actually23:20
@sonney2klots of breaks / fun events23:20
@sonney2kbut we can reduce user contributed talks23:20
@sonney2kand have a longer break or longer user contrib talks23:20
cwidmersounds good23:20
@sonney2kalright so much about the program23:21
@sonney2kwe could use gsoc money for travel support / food23:22
cwidmerok, sounds good23:22
@sonney2kso then last topic is who does what?23:22
@sonney2kand where is heiko?23:22
cwidmerare there any volunteers to contact companies about sponsoring?23:22
blackburnI expect sonney2k is the man :D23:23
blackburnbut I can try too23:23
cwidmerheh, maybe not a bad idea23:23
cwidmermaybe this needs some seniority23:23
blackburnyes it does23:23
@sonney2kwe need someone who updates the website with the current program proposal and posts this to the mailinglist23:24
blackburnI don't have any23:24
@sonney2kblackburn, ok ok I am doing this23:24
@sonney2kthe company / sponsoring stuff I mean23:24
n4nd0I can update the website23:24
@sonney2kn4nd0, cool thanks!23:24
cwidmerok, I can write to the mailing list23:24
cwidmerunless you just want to post the same stuff, then you can do it both in one go?23:25
@sonney2kn4nd0, just create a new post but write *draft* of the program clearly :D23:25
@sonney2kso once that is done and I talked to the c-base people for real23:25
cwidmern4nd0, it's your call23:25
@sonney2kall that is left to do is the call for contributions/announcement email23:25
@sonney2kand then the real organization23:26
@sonney2kI mean bying food / ordering pizza / coffee right?23:26
@sonney2kand well volunteers to set up c-base in the morning for the event23:26
n4nd0cwidmer: I can write it on the ml too ;)23:26
blackburnso nothing for me :D23:27
cwidmern4nd0, ok thanks23:27
@sonney2kn4nd0, just tell cwidmer/me when you want a review of the post :)23:27
cwidmerso who is setting up the workshop mailling list, sonney2k?23:27
@sonney2kcwidmer, yes :/23:27
@sonney2kbut it is easy :D23:27
cwidmerand blackburn will manage it23:27
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n4nd0good plan23:28
@sonney2kwe don't have a task for heiko23:28
@sonney2kgive it to him :D23:28
cwidmerso will there be _TWO_ posts to the ml or one?23:28
@sonney2kcwidmer, one with the draft for now23:28
cwidmercontributions/announcement email will be the same as prelimiary schedule, right?23:28
@sonney2kahh heiko - could you write a call for contrib/announcement?23:28
@sonney2kcwidmer, no no23:29
cwidmerok, so there are two then23:29
@sonney2kcwidmer, just one draft to the mailinglist for now23:29
@sonney2kthe real stuff will follow once everything is settled23:29
@sonney2kheiko, ?23:29
cwidmerso n4nd0 will set up the draft, sonney2k and I will review before it's send, ok23:30
@sonney2kcwidmer, oh btw we forgot about the shogun e.V. in the schedule23:30
@sonney2kwe need a slot for this23:30
@sonney2k30 mins likely23:30
cwidmerwhat is it about?23:31
cwidmershouldn't we do this on the second internal day?23:31
cwidmerthis is usually the part that external people really skip, as it has little relevance to them23:32
heikosonney2k, can do23:32
@sonney2kcwidmer, only issue is that I am not around the day after23:32
cwidmerargh, that's too bad23:32
@sonney2kor we do it in the morning or evening before?23:33
@sonney2kI will be killed for that23:33
cwidmerwhere's the fun in hackathons without sonney2k... shogun will be ported to boost without you knowing :P23:33
cwidmerfamily obligations?23:33
@sonney2kcwidmer, directly before summer holidays23:34
blackburnporting to boost !23:34
cwidmershould we all meet on the day before then?23:34
cwidmerI don't know, we'll have to see23:35
cwidmerwho has time when23:35
heikoI will be in Berlin the day before23:35
heikoprobably everybody who travels will be23:35
@sonney2kcwidmer, otherwise we do the shogun e.V. stuff at 10 am23:35
heikocurrently having diner so not having an eye on the chat all the time23:36
cwidmerok, that would work23:36
alexlovesdata1my coconut tofu soup is ready :)23:36
@sonney2kalright so lets add this to the schedule?23:37
blackburnI am ok to meet around 2 days23:37
blackburn+- :)23:37
cwidmeryeah, I think we should have an additional, possibly more internal but not exclusive day23:38
cwidmerwould be too bad if sonney2k couldn't attend23:39
alexlovesdata1couldn't we prepare the founding of shogun e.V. ?23:40
alexlovesdata1aka shogun toolbox e.V.23:40
alexlovesdata1so that we have only little to discuss DURing the day?23:40
cwidmerok then23:40
cwidmeranything left to discuss?23:40
n4nd0don't think so23:41
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, sure - but who can do that?23:41
n4nd0I have to re-read what e.V. is again though hehe23:41
@sonney2kwould be great if somebody could write up the 'Satzung'23:41
alexlovesdata1ok writing a Satzung sounds a reasonable job for me ... but I would need to discuss by mail23:43
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, heiko could you?23:44
@sonney2kcool cool23:44
@sonney2kI think we are done then23:44
cwidmeralexlovesdata1, sounds great23:44
@sonney2kwe should meet after Feb 1st23:44
cwidmerok, how about Feb 2nd23:44
cwidmersame time?23:44
@sonney2kOK with me23:44
@sonney2kblackburn, n4nd0 ^23:45
cwidmerfeb 3rd would be better for me23:45
blackburnworks for me23:45
cwidmerhave a visitor on 2nd23:45
blackburnany 1/2/323:45
@sonney2k3rd then?23:45
n4nd03rd yeah23:46
n4nd02nd is bad for me23:46
@sonney2kheiko, ^23:46
@sonney2k3rd ok?23:46
n4nd0I have something on the 3rd starting at 16:00 but I should be done by 21-2223:47
@sonney2knext meeting will be quick23:48
cwidmerok sounds good, this was pretty productive23:49
@sonney2kalright everyone then23:49
cwidmerlooking forward to this workshop and to meeting some you guys in person23:49
@sonney2kthanks for the chat23:49
@sonney2kblackburn, vodka bottle empty?23:49
@sonney2kmy beer is!23:49
blackburnsonney2k: yes dead drunk already :)23:49
@sonney2keveryone cu around on the 3rd!23:50
@sonney2kblackburn, time to fix the bug then!23:50
blackburnsonney2k: good idea23:50
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cwidmerok, see you guys!23:51
nandoI am facing some troubles with my connection :S23:51
blackburnsee you23:51
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alexlovesdata1see you in Berlin, the capital of the grumpy people ;)23:52
@sonney2kand homeless people !23:52
@sonney2kand shoguners!23:52
alexlovesdata1couldn't you all chat faster ?? :D23:52
blackburnalexlovesdata1: ahah you should check out moscow23:52
@sonney2kalexlovesdata1, no more sex for you now?23:53
blackburnI bet it is much more grumpy23:53
@sonney2kwake her up!23:53
blackburnwe all owe you a sex23:53
nandotime for me to go too23:53
@sonney2kblackburn, not sure we are allowed to use shogun money for that ;)23:53
@sonney2knando, cu!23:53
nandogn people! it was nice this meeting :)23:54
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heikoalexlovesdata1, we can do the satzung together23:55
--- Log closed Sun Jan 27 00:00:38 2013